E10 fuel

nice_ef · 21-05-2012, 02:47 PM

Hey guys not sure if I'm in the right spot but I will give it a crack...I just wanted to know if i can run my car on the e10 fuel I have a 03 xr6 turbo with a 9psi tune if any one could help that would be great

just_pazz · 21-05-2012, 03:14 PM

use at your own peril ......

**Silver Ghia** · 21-05-2012, 03:43 PM

Wouldn't use it in my lawnmower.

nice_ef · 21-05-2012, 04:14 PM

Yeah was abit suss about it but thought I would still ask I think I will just stick to bp ultimate

Mr H · 21-05-2012, 04:17 PM

the only car that i know that recommends it is my wifes toyota aurion zr6. it even says to use it on the cap....

flappist · 21-05-2012, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nice_ef

Hey guys not sure if I'm in the right spot but I will give it a crack...I just wanted to know if i can run my car on the e10 fuel I have a 03 xr6 turbo with a 9psi tune if any one could help that would be great

This is an emotive issue. On here are the ethanol fans and ethanol haters.

If the reason you want to use e10 is puerly financial then remember even if you are saving 10c/l that is only $1.40 per 100km, $140 per 10,000km or maybe $300 a year.

Lot of risk for not much gain....

nice_ef · 21-05-2012, 04:40 PM

Didn't really think of it like that your right a little to much risk for not alot of gain thanks flappist....I will just stick with what I know

Yellow_Festiva · 21-05-2012, 04:46 PM

There are several sites floating around that have 'official' lists of what can and can't run on E10.

While your car may be E10 safe, the discount you get over regular fuel is lost by higher consumption in most cases.

Being a turbo motor I personally wouldn't. I would stick to 95 minimum as many E10 pumps around Sydney have 91 RON....

The Monty · 21-05-2012, 04:50 PM

I got a flat tyre when I ran E10.....

I wouldnt run it in a custom tune, unless it was E10 in 95 or 98 and thats what your car was tuned to.
Ive been running it for 8 years now, in my NA cars, never had a problem.

Rodp · 21-05-2012, 05:53 PM

I've had to run it a few times in my F6. Didn't notice all that much difference but I wouldn't feel comfortable running it full time.

In a pinch, you could probably get away with it. If you're looking to run it full time, I wouldn't.

Halfmo Rocks · 22-05-2012, 01:05 AM

i used it for years in BA's & BF's...XT & N/A XR6...with no noticeable difference in power or economy
but back when i had a BA turbo i thought it said 95 minimum, so i wouldn't run it in a factory stock turbo, let alone a tuned one

Alister · 22-05-2012, 11:09 AM

XR6 Turbos seem to hate it (economy wise).
My modded one I had before ran well on it but economy sucked. Same with my stocko XR6T at the moment. On E10, it uses at least 1.5L/100KM more than 95RON.

Power wise - perfect.

Pepscobra · 05-10-2014, 03:04 PM

Sorry to dig up and old issue... Just want to see what people's views on E10 fuel are now?

Reason I ask is, I recently filled up with E10 just to give it a go and I got over a L/100km improvement in fuel economy. Down from 13.1L to 11.8L/100kms.

Is it safe to use long term?
My car is a 2004 Ford Escape V6.

Cheers.

commodorenutt · 05-10-2014, 08:13 PM

My experience with numerous company cars (I do 40k/yr in them) as well as my own cars & wife's daily, is that E10 doesn't do any harm to standard cars with modern fuel systems designed for it, but the economy issues pointed out above have been mirrored in nearly every one of my experiences, ranging from a Subaru 4, a few different Aussie 6s (Ford, Holden & Toyota) and several gen3/4 GM v8s.

Most of the fuel cards I've had were limited to E10, but my local servo (matching the brand of the card) was often out of E10 so I would put 95 in on the corporate credit card. The difference for me was most noticeable in a VE V6 I had from '08-11. I could do 600km on a tank (70L fill) of 95, but this dropped to 550km or so when back on E10. This was annoying as my work is 60km away from home, so 600 to a tank meant I only had to fill it once a week, but 550 only got me 4.5 days running. The VE was nearly 10% worse, but the AU & BA weren't as dramatic. The Subaru was "recommended" minimum 95, but the tightasses also limited the card to E10. Ironically it was almost impossible to pick the economy difference in it when cruising on light throttle, but the power loss on 91 was noticeable, and you usually ended up driving it harder, using more.

Since it got my LPi G6 in 2011, I haven't had as much first-hand experience with E10, but some recent comparisons I've done with my wife's 6L still confirm this is the case. It gets driven easily, and event though she's only down about 5% on true mileage from a tank compared to 95, this is enough to negates any savings, unless the price gap is 7c or more.

cro142 · 05-10-2014, 08:22 PM

I tried E10 in my 03 Turbo a few years ago.

It made the car miss under acceleration and generally run rough.
I gave it away after a couple of tanks.

Why would you use an inferior fuel which makes your car run rough?
As well, the long term effects may be quite serious.
It's actually even more expensive to use - consumption goes up by about 10% but the fuel is not 10% cheaper.

Avoid E10 would be my advice.

yearby · 06-10-2014, 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepscobra

Sorry to dig up and old issue... Just want to see what people's views on E10 fuel are now?

Reason I ask is, I recently filled up with E10 just to give it a go and I got over a L/100km improvement in fuel economy. Down from 13.1L to 11.8L/100kms.

Is it safe to use long term?
My car is a 2004 Ford Escape V6.

Cheers.

The general accepted norm is 3% (2.8% is closer) worse fuel economy for E10 and 30% worse fuel economy for E85 but everyone thinks that E10 should be a direct replacement for 91 unleaded. E10 has a octane rating about 94, which is more suited to vehicles designed to run on premium 95, E10 is some where lost in no mans land between engines designed to run on 91 and those designed to run 95, in other word not suited to either engine.

What is needed is to increase the compression ratio to take advantage of the higher octane, bit difficult to do unless you are rebuilding the engine to suit.
Hypothetically, if you could raise the compression ratio say from 9:1 to 10:1 to use the higher octane E10 fuel, it would raise the power out put of the E10 fuel by 3% and increase economy by about 6%. Meaning that all the power and fuel economy lost by using E10 would be regained with a minimal increase in fuel economy over 91 unleaded.

An alternate idea would be to use a vehicle designed to run premium 95 and tune it to run E10.
This may be what is happening with your 2004 Ford Escape V6, don't know but defiantly food for thought, seems too good to be just a coincidence, although I have come across stranger things than this.

Generally when you put an ethanol fuel into a vehicle that has never used it before, the first thing it does is absorb all the water and crap in the fuel tank and lines and flush it straight through the engine. Hence it's reputation for engines running badly.
Obviously your 2004 Ford Escape V6 must have a clean fuel system, in fact the E10 may have cleaned up your fuel lines/injectors already.

E10 has a lower energy content than 91 unleaded, so is highly possible that exhaust temperatures would be lower and lower exhaust temperatures on a low boost turbo engine could result in slower spool speed build up making the a turbo engine seem sluggish. (E85 high boost is totally different). So it possibly not suited for turbo engines.

I am not familiar with the Ford Escape so don't know of any problems associated with it running E10, but in my opinion if you monitor your vehicle, change fuel filters regularly, and the engine don't ping etc,etc, I would keep using the E10.

Peter

Pepscobra · 06-10-2014, 05:38 PM

Thanks for the detailed post Peter.
Filled up with Vortex95 on Sunday. After that tank, will fill up with E10 again to do another comparison.
Cheers.

Brodes · 06-10-2014, 06:00 PM

I stopped and filled up my EL XR8 at a servo once because I thought "oh gee the fuel's really cheap here" , only to realise it was E10 after the tank was full

. Can't say I noticed any difference in full consumption or power. Wouldn't put a drop back in again though, the ol' windsor ain't built for it.

keithedel · 31-10-2014, 01:17 AM

i am an expert, there are no experts on earth that use ethanol in there own road cars. unless they intend to keep them for a short period of time.you will notice that some bowsers display the sign "do not use in any aircraft of any type"maybe they should add "or else you will die quickly" take their hint, take my hint!!!

simon varley · 31-10-2014, 08:11 AM

E10 in the VE SS is awesome. I've run ethanol blends for years back in England and in fact I don't think you can even buy 'pure' petrol there any more. If the book says you can use it then do so if you want

Itsme · 31-10-2014, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keithedel

i am an expert, there are no experts on earth that use ethanol in there own road cars. unless they intend to keep them for a short period of time.you will notice that some bowsers display the sign "do not use in any aircraft of any type"maybe they should add "or else you will die quickly" take their hint, take my hint!!!

Quote:

Ethanol can absorb significant amounts of water in flight.

Quote:

Ethanol may vent off at altitude, reducing both range and octane

This is the only reason you do not use ethanol type fuel in aircraft

Qwik6 · 31-10-2014, 11:45 AM

I use E10 in my last 2 daily's, a ED XR6 and 98 Fairmont 4.0, no issues at all.

Also I have run 100ron E10 in my EB 4.0 for atleast 6yrs, the last 3yrs i run a 60/40 mic of 100ron & E85. Stock fuel system except the 24lbs injectors and the tune.

Too much scare mongering over E85. I've never seen Ethanol issues in the workshops ive worked in the last 8-9yrs.

mik · 31-10-2014, 12:29 PM

I guess it depends on the car, my xr6 most assuredly loses k's out of a tank and it pings I t s guts out on e10, noticeably when cold it runs rougher .

Cranky243 · 31-10-2014, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keithedel

i am an expert, there are no experts on earth that use ethanol in there own road cars. unless they intend to keep them for a short period of time.you will notice that some bowsers display the sign "do not use in any aircraft of any type"maybe they should add "or else you will die quickly" take their hint, take my hint!!!

Lol you're not a affiliated with BP or similar are you?

P100 E10 100 octane from united made all pump 98 octane fuels look dismal.

Take a hint

**kypez** · 31-10-2014, 01:54 PM

E10 is usually 94/95 Octane (at united and it was at Shell till they rebranded). I think some people are peddling the 91 line to encourage more sale of the 95 Premium. Nothing wrong with the stuff in a modern car. Sure you might burn a little more but I think the whole debate has been blown out of proportion.

That said, I run 98 and have used 100 United without issue in my car.

**kypez** · 31-10-2014, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Wouldn't use it in my lawnmower.

nor should you cause the mower wouldnt be E10 compatible...

vztrt · 31-10-2014, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

E10 is usually 94/95 Octane (at united and it was at Shell till they rebranded). I think some people are peddling the 91 line to encourage more sale of the 95 Premium. Nothing wrong with the stuff in a modern car. Sure you might burn a little more but I think the whole debate has been blown out of proportion.

That said, I run 98 and have used 100 United without issue in my car.

Ran United E10 for years in the NA Falcon and they went well. Funny enough they used the same amount of fuel as regular 91 and even 95 and was 50km worse off a tank then 98. But the car ran the same as it did with 91 & 95...only 98 did the car actually feel nicer.

The Turbo ute I just run 98 and its fine. Caltex seems to be the best for k's in long runs from what I found.

335POWER · 31-10-2014, 05:54 PM

I run e85 in my NA FG XR6 on a stock fuel system other than larger injectors and tune, and have never had an issue. Uses slightly more, but meh

devilcv8 · 31-10-2014, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simon varley

E10 in the VE SS is awesome. I've run ethanol blends for years back in England and in fact I don't think you can even buy 'pure' petrol there any more. If the book says you can use it then do so if you want

Over 5 years I ran a VE SS ute primarily on e10. 252000 km and zero problems

**GasoLane** · 31-10-2014, 08:42 PM

Mercedes Australia says 10% is ok but not more.

"Use of fuel with an ethanol content higher than 10% may result in engine malfunction, starting and operating difficulties and materials degradation. These adverse effects could result in permanent damage to your vehicle. Purchasing your fuel from a reputable supplier may reduce the risk of exceeding this 10% limit or of receiving fuel with abnormal properties."