Major Ford announcement....

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by Paxton

This is odd, because there isn't (to my knowledge) a DSG gearbox currently in use that will fit the North/South, Front Engine, Rear Drive setup that Falcon currently.

Don't worry about the ZF and TR, they're going nowhere; there's no DSG (from Ford) capable of handling the torque levels of the I6T and V8.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

HEY! Paxton! Your avatar just aged 50 years!

I'm not surprised, given the amount of muppet posts in this thread.

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by z80

My predictions:-

-Geelong engine plant will close or become token body stamping/parts manufacture.
-4 cylinder Falcon will be front wheel drive.....
-wagon/estate falcons will cease to exist, with Territory the wagon option.
-The LPG price is artificially low, the I6 is a dead duck, as is the Aussie engine plant.
-V8 Ford engines will be no more, in favour of boosted offerings
-4 cylinder falcon will struggle to compete with Jap Mivec/VVT offerings

The Aussie dollar is about 82 cents to the US.

We have no hope of competitively manufacturing anything when our dollar is high.

Holden,Ford,Mitsubishi ...same sheet different day.

Join the Asian third world pay and conditions or say goodbye to jobs.

Looks like the jobs gotta go then.... :

Well aren't you mr negative... Glad you weren't defending our country during the war.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by z80

My predictions:-

-Geelong engine plant will close or become token body stamping/parts manufacture.
-4 cylinder Falcon will be front wheel drive.....
-wagon/estate falcons will cease to exist, with Territory the wagon option.
-The LPG price is artificially low, the I6 is a dead duck, as is the Aussie engine plant.
-V8 Ford engines will be no more, in favour of boosted offerings
-4 cylinder falcon will struggle to compete with Jap Mivec/VVT offerings

The Aussie dollar is about 82 cents to the US.

We have no hope of competitively manufacturing anything when our dollar is high.

Holden,Ford,Mitsubishi ...same sheet different day.

Join the Asian third world pay and conditions or say goodbye to jobs.

Looks like the jobs gotta go then.... :

My predictions:

- Your post is stupid and many will think so.

- The Engine plant is seperate from the Stamping plant and will remain so.

- The Engine plant will continue to manufature I6 engines.

- You will look stupid again with your prediction that the i4T will be FWD.

- V8 Will continue.

- 4 Cylinder Falcon will not compete with C & D class Japnese smaller vehicles but will create it's own 'place' and will revive Falcon sales.

- The LiLPG I6 wil be a winner as it'll give near Petrol performance and economy with a much cheaper running cost.

- You will continue to look for a job, but you will FAIL because you're not really smart.

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Paxton

This is odd, because there isn't (to my knowledge) a DSG gearbox currently in use that will fit the North/South, Front Engine, Rear Drive setup that Falcon currently.

I remember hearing something about the same gearbox as Focus etc?

[GT69]

It all sounds good, Ford wont release a dud.


What im wondering is where these new engine types will fit in with pricing, as we know, the XT at the bottom, XR6 then XR6T and XR8's running at about the same price, then the G series.

Where would an I4T fit in? If Ford are chasing the fuel efficient family car market, then a vehicle like this would be in or around the high spec'd XT - XR6 market, It can be as efficient as it likes, i cant see something like an I4T sitting next to the XR6T and XR8 as far as pricing is concerned.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

My predictions:

- Your post is stupid and many will think so.

- The Engine plant is seperate from the Stamping plant and will remain so.

- The Engine plant will continue to manufature I6 engines.

- You will look stupid again with your prediction that the i4T will be FWD.

- V8 Will continue.

- 4 Cylinder Falcon will not compete with C & D class Japnese smaller vehicles but will create it's own 'place' and will revive Falcon sales.

- The LiLPG I6 wil be a winner as it'll give near Petrol performance and economy with a much cheaper running cost.

- You will continue to look for a job, but you will FAIL because you're not really smart.

My predictions:

you are correct.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

My predictions:

- Your post is stupid and many will think so.

This prediction only took a few minutes to come true! Amazing



| [/url] |

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by auslandau

This prediction only took a few minutes to come true! Amazing

Its magic....

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

I remember hearing something about the same gearbox as Focus etc?

Focus is Front Wheel Drive.

Falcon is not.

See a problem here?

[ehast13]

What weight would you expect a 4 pot falc to get down to?

1600 ish?

With an alloy block, would it get into the high 15oo's?

The E200k is 1580kg. The e-class mercs are pretty similar with weight (model for model) with the falcon.

Ford promises AT LEAST 240hp and 240 ft/lb from the 2.o ecoboost. The explorer america concept had over 200kw (205kw) and 380nm

240hp is about 180kw

a 180kw four pot in a 1600kg car with suitable gearing will be a good top end performer.

With a claimed 320nm from 1500rpm to 5000rpm, it should be pretty swift.

What gearing would be needed to give it the customary SHOVE of the line (the first 0 - 10kph) before boost kicks in??

who wants to take a guess at box and diff ratios, weight and fuel economy?

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Focus is Front Wheel Drive.

Falcon is not.

See a problem here?

Very true, however I did start early this morning so brain not going at full pace ( is it ever?) but I do remember the comment about the same gearbox as Focus. Or maybe it shares the same technology?

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Very true, however I did start early this morning so brain not going at full pace ( is it ever?) but I do remember the comment about the same gearbox as Focus. Or maybe it shares the same technology?

Same technology.

Same gearbox isn't really possible.

Plenty of Overtime at Geelong Stamping is there?

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Same technology.

Same gearbox isn't really possible.

Plenty of Overtime at Geelong Body is there?

Geelong Stamping has a bit from what I'm hearing....hey Gobes ?

[Terraplainin']

On balance, I think the announcements are generally good news. Sorry to see that the Focus won’t be built, as I reckon that it would future proof local manufacturing better than the current plans, but it’s not the end of the world.

However, is there any logical reason for going for the 2.7 l V6 diesel rather than the current 3.0 l V6 version? Is the 2.7 for 2010 to be the same as the superseded motor, or a revised version?

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Geelong Stamping has a bit from what I'm hearing....hey Gobes ?

Too true, and now I am off to bed so I am all fresh for Saturday o'time........ Someone has to keep all you Ford fans supplied with G6ET's.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Too true, and now I am off to bed so I am all fresh for Saturday o'time........ Someone has to keep all you Ford fans supplied with G6ET's.

Nice....

Punch out those engine hood outers

I drove a G6ET the other day. Best car I've ever driven... bar none !!

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Too true, and now I am off to bed so I am all fresh for Saturday o'time........ Someone has to keep all you Ford fans supplied with G6ET's.

Any of the other plants doing the same, or is it just stamping?

[JPFS1]

It's all looking good... ;)

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Nice....

Punch out those engine hood outers

I drove a G6ET the other day. Best car I've ever driven... bar none !!

Ute roof today, and now we have 222 (BF Wagon) and 8R29 hood to look forward to on Monday, I love it.........

[Falcon Coupe]

Originally Posted by Terraplainin'

However, is there any logical reason for going for the 2.7 l V6 diesel rather than the current 3.0 l V6 version? Is the 2.7 for 2010 to be the same as the superseded motor, or a revised version?

The only logical reason could be price, they may have scored a good deal on surplus supply ?
That said, the 2.7L diesel in question easily out powers all of the Japanese dual cab 3.0L diesel utes, most of which have 3 tonne towing capacities.

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Any of the other plants doing the same, or is it just stamping?

Engine plant worked back 4 hours on Wednesday night, the first time in about 5 years, ha ha ha.......

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Engine plant worked back 4 hours on Wednesday night, the first time in about 5 years, ha ha ha.......

Mmmmmmmmm.....Turbo's :

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Gobes - as for the Wagon; what can I say, the bastard keeps selling. Damian and you are lucky that you are in the same boat in regards to legacy platforms. Ford will probably fluke a business case for the Wagon through, mainly because they are the only supplier for a vehicle of its versatility.

The thing I can't understand is, will the I4T sit behind a DSG box, or will it appear with the ZF and the TR6060?

The thing is, something HAS to happen with the wagon by Euro 4, otherwise it's curtains (assuming Ford wants to keep selling them).

Also, with today's announcement, where does that leave, uhh, 'other' projects that were in the pipleline along with the Focus?

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

The thing is, something HAS to happen with the wagon by Euro 4, otherwise it's curtains (assuming Ford wants to keep selling them).

Also, with today's announcement, where does that leave, uhh, 'other' projects that were in the pipleline along with the Focus?

Such as?

[Swordsman88]

Well i've been out of the loop for the day..and what a day to go awol from AFF LOL!

Lots of happening.

First impressions upon reading this:

-diesel territory...no surprise there, but a bit of a wait. Probably gurantees nex gen territory won't make it till well into 2011....so just slot in the Euro 4 engines next year and other than that....nada. Those waiting for the all new terri are in for a bit of a wait....just buy that SY2...you know its good enough.

- LI LPG I6 - also rather obvious. Good to see its coming here sooner rather than later - this will render the fleet sales of falcon a big boost. Plus assuming ford ditches the BTR and goes 5 (or 6??) speeds on the auto...a G6E LI LPG looks pretty tasty for private buyers too

- 4 cylinder falcon. FAARK...they atcually are going to do it!!!! Its been rumoured a while, but i was surprised it was actually announced this early on for a project quite a way off. I suppose they were trying to soften the focus cancellation

- focus binned...always a bit shakey small cars in this country, not really set up for the manufacturing of them in sufficient numbers. Also, the lack of progress on the Kuga and similar focus platformed vehicles illustrated Ford was not committed on the focus production line IMO.

As for the actuall 4 pot engine...bring it on i reckon. As noted by others, the I6 and I6T will remain, and i think the V8 too. I dont' buy this 'FPV only' V8 theory...sure FPV do all the work, but that doesn't mean ford won't take some of the units to put in XRs (or even G8Es....). The I4T will become an 'econetic' option in effect. Whether it is standard on base models (and you make the I6 a 'performance' engine or HO set up) like XT/G6 or alternatively its a greeny option i don't mind. Hell at those expected numbers (approx 200/370-380) it will wipe the floor with that 3.0 V6 commodore.

Either way i look forward to test driving one of these I4T bangers....could be alot of fun.

My only concern (and it ain't a big one) is how will this all fit in with the rest of the line up. Fiesta/Focus are safe as small cars, and if you do bring in the Kuga to replace Escape i don't think a territory would be cross shopped much given the difference in sales. But Mondeo is puzzling. Wouldn't a I4T falcon basically just usurp a XR5T mondeo. Hell the base falcon would burn less and be quicker than a Mondeo Zetec. Maybe the answer comes when you realise that in Europe the mondeo is rumoured to be getting an 1.6 I4T ecoboost to replace the 2.3. Its a brave new world of technology and product at Ford at the moment...and Ford Aus is smack bang in the middle of it.

Now more than ever, Going Ford is the Going Thing!!!! :

[mik]

Originally Posted by HSE2

If I am not a fan of the 4 cylinder commodore I can hardly support the concept in a Falcon and I don’t.

Large cars, small engines don’t work unless people learn to drive differently. Want to increase fuel economy in large cars then the best way is to cut weight and that’s very expensive to do.

If supposedly the future is "smart is small" then all Ford Aust have now done is sink more dollars into the product that doesn't move volume the likes of the projected Focus. What will change to make up the number of units that is now lost? I know which concept looks safest in the long run albeit on paper.

This is a continuation on heading down the path of Ford Australia being out on its own and I think long term that can only lead to one conclusion. The glow of short term gain casts a long term viability shadow.
I know this will be unpopular but the hard decisions made by Gorman had a more integrated global them than that of the current management. I hope there is more long term depth here than meets the eye.

An announcement that injects life into the supposed large car segment or equivalent of the titanic.

I think this is disappointing and question where it will put us in 3 to 4 years time.

i don`t think you can compare an old 4cyl commy with a starfire 4 engine to a modern falcon 4, the the 4 cylander commy was hugely powerfull (sarcasm)....... with a massive 58 fwkw`s and 140nm of (`RAW POWER')....attempt at humor , lest we not throw the fruit away with out first tasting it.

[JPFS1]

i'll be in deep discussions tomorrow... not here, but I might report back

[JOF062]

Good...!

[EL97]

The Ecoboost will most likely be standard on the XT, fleet buyers would be attracted to the economy.