Speed camera increasing accidents....

[vztrt]

http://www.caradvice.com.au/129931/s...dal-in-the-uk/

Speed camera scandal in the UK
By Anthony Crawford | July 26th, 2011

Under new government rules in the UK, transport authorities in all counties are required to publish speed camera statistics. The county of Lancashire is one of the first to do so, and the locals are up in arms about the results.

It turns out that three speed cameras alone in the city of Preston has netted over £18,000 in fines, but accidents have actually increased.

The chairman of the Association of British Drivers Brain Gregory was clearly annoyed when he told the Lancashire Evening Post,

“Not only is it scandalous that the cameras where casualties have increased have been kept in operation for many years, it is even more disturbing that the authorities have hidden this data and authorised continued operation while being in possession of this knowledge. The government should get a grip and insist that those responsible for such malpractice in all regions are removed from public service with immediate effect.”

Perhaps this episode should be a heads up for Roads and Traffic authorities in Australia to examine the results of all the so called ‘Safety cameras’ in operation here for the purposes of discovering the effectiveness of these devices in reducing trauma and congestion on our roads.

Of course, traffic accidents in general, have fallen across the UK and in Australia over the last five years, but that’s due to a combination of factors including, more advanced vehicle safety systems and other traffic management measures, making it difficult to assess the overall effectiveness of speed cameras.

Are speed (sorry, ‘Safety’) cameras necessary, or are they merely automatic revenue collection boxes that are generally placed on straight stretches of road to catch us out?

[Ben73]

[falconnut]

I like this.

[TheInterceptor]

Me likes.

If Govco were to release those stats theyd probobly be doctored and twisted to suit their sob story garbage mantra.

[bungarra]

Wait for Sudzy and kpcart to come in and tell you you hate the police or your against govco and if you don't speed.. blah blah blah.

to add to the theme: http://www.news.com.au/national/cove...-1225874581910

The Queensland Police Union has questioned Qovernment claims that covert speed cameras are behind a fall in road deaths.

The Government announced the introduction of covert speed cameras and unmarked police motorcycles in December last year as part of a package of road safety initiatives.

But the number of fatalities per week had increased since covert speed cameras were introduced, union president Ian Leavers said on Wednesday.

"There is not a shred of evidence that they have had any positive impact in reducing fatalities on our roads," he said.

"I fear that the Bligh Government is becoming addicted to the revenue of speed cameras."

Mr Leavers said many police officers believed covert speed cameras were "like poker machines on wheels".

"Sure they rake in the dollars, however the deterrent effect for speedsters is non-existent," he said.
The Government is due to hand down the 2010/11 State Budget on June 8, which will reveal its revenue forecasts

[Falc'man]

No surprise. People have their eyes focussed on the speedo and oblivious to everything else.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

No surprise. People have their eyes focussed on the speedo and oblivious to everything else.

Yeah but if your below the speed limit you don't need to concentrate on the road!!!!

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Yeah but if your below the speed limit you don't need to concentrate on the road!!!!

what was I thinking.

[Matty4]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

what was I thinking.

Nothing, apparently "they" do it all for us these days..............

[sudszy]

Wow, another anti speed camera article by another motoring journalist that has declared which car companies pay for his overseas junkets to test fast cars?

Same old, same old.....people here can’t even research the basic facts of lack of behind the story, ?

Well, the basic facts are very hard to come by......3 cameras in Lancashire recorded an increase in accidents nearby over last years figures? And how many accidents was that and how many people were being booked”? one of the cameras only recorded nine speeding infractions in the whole year, obviously its there for revenue raising


What didn’t we hear from our motoring journalist:

According to latest Government figures the number of people killed or seriously injured on the roads in Lancashire is at a 30 year low. There were 798 such incidents last year compared to 852 in 2009.

There are actually 282 speed cameras in Lancashire: http://safe2travel.co.uk/cameras.asp, are we to assume(Im guessing that we'd of heard otherwise if it were not the case) that the other 279 of them show decreasing or static trends? Personally I haven’t got time to check em all, but others are welcome.

Oh, yes, but any anti camera fanatic would trot out this one just like UK motoring groups do too:
“And driving groups say the figures, which the Government ordered the release of yesterday, do not prove that cameras have reduced accidents, because the number of accidents on every road in the country have plummeted in recent years, better cars, safety features etc”

There you have it, definite proof that speed cameras have no effect on reducing incidents, but anywhere where there is a blip and the accident rates go up speed cameras are definitely causing the accidents!

Of course other reasons as to why accidents on “every road”(I don’t think every road) , including non camera roads have decreased:

1. people have slowed down because they believe they could be photographed anywhere any time and have changed their driving habits accordingly

2. Or indeed the morons who have been picked up by the cameras and have refused to change their habits and have been disqualified from driving have been prevented from contributing to the road toll!

are these entertained by our journo or the anti camera folk......... .

But what do we hear from our esteemed journalist?:

consult safety authorities for any other relevant info?: no just gets a comment from Brain? or is it Brian Gregory of the Association of British motorists:
http://www.abd.org.uk/pr/717.htm(= nut jobs who have created a website for people bleating about being fined etc)

“Not only is it scandalous that the cameras where casualties have increased have been kept in operation for many years, it is even more disturbing that the authorities have hidden this data and authorised continued operation while being in possession of this knowledge. The government should get a grip and insist that those responsible for such malpractice in all regions are removed from public service with immediate effect.”

wow, now even Im convinced

[Linkachu]

Everyone likes this.

Except the Australian government.

[falconnut]

Here we go.

[kpcart]

yeh here we go.. the speeders like this, and normal people who drive sensibly in the speed limit and dont get fines - wont.

-saying people spend too long looking at there speedo is nonsense, i see people staring in the rear view mirror while driving! or looking at the mobile phones. that is worse. glancing at your speedo takes a micro amount of time, as does observing your surroundings and checking your mirrors, good drivers can do it, others cant because they dont want to, simple as that. if your a good driver, you can feel you speed in your car, and you can hear the revs and feel your foot on the accelerator pedal.

ahh aussie drivers - they can do it while learing to drive and while sitting their drivers test, but after that, they search for every excuse in the book because they hate the fact they just paid a voluntary tax!! (speeding fine).

infact im beginning to think it is less safe to stare in the distance looking for speed cameras, so you can momuntarily slow down, then it is to quickly glance at your speedo.

how come old people, with slower brains and reactions can drive within the speed limit? boggles the mind doesnt it for some of you cowboys.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by kpcart

yeh here we go.. the speeders like this, and normal people who drive sensibly in the speed limit and dont get fines - wont.

Always a good idea to generalize isn't it? Helps you make your point easier even if you get it wrong.

Originally Posted by sudszy

Well, the basic facts are very hard to come by......3 cameras in Lancashire recorded an increase in accidents nearby over last years figures? And how many accidents was that and how many people were being booked”? one of the cameras only recorded nine speeding infractions in the whole year, obviously its there for revenue raising

So everyone is going slow and accident numbers still increase?
No way. That must mean there are other causes of accidents!

[burnz]

if govco is soooo worried about our safety remove us from the equation.

GPS limit our cars.. then remove all camera's as they wont need them.

[kpcart]

by the way the australian population, and especially the number of cars and drivers on the road is increasing, (as well as the population of arrogant drivers who like to drive at whatever speed they want). so ofcourse the road fatality statistics will increase.

To many people, getting a fine makes them think more when they drive and focus on not breaking rules, as they dont want another penalty.... BUT to the likes of people in this forum and especially "car enthusiats" it just brings out more hate against authority. whats wrong with people these days? you all hate authority, but when you are in serious trouble, whats the first number you call? 000 (until the next day, when you start complaining about how long they took to provide help to your obnoxious needs).

[sarrge2001]

Originally Posted by kpcart

blah, blah, same old rhetoric zzzz....zzz...zzzzzzz...

Originally Posted by sudszy

blah, blah, blah, same old soapbox, must........educate......the ignorant........zzzz....zzz...zzzzzzz...

It's getting tiresome, whether I agree with your points or not.......

[DJR-351]

Ban Speed Camera Threads.......

[Grunter]

Originally Posted by DJR-351

Ban Speed Camera Threads.......

No, just ban the usual suspects, who feel the need to continually push their extreme views both ways, with zero acceptance for any view points other than their own.

Except for those few muppets, the vast majority of members can discuss these types of topics rationally with no problems, and without having to resort to belittling others views.

I will say that I believe speed cameras do slow down most motorists overall (edit. should have said "most motorists that may let their speed creep up a little. those that willfully speed, will continue to do so). I don't think a great number of cameras are in locations that have a recent history of speed related accidents (in my observation). I do completely believe that the current government in Qld use them as a revenue stream with no real aim at safety. It's a perception thing that if the speed camera revenue was directed to road safety improvements (training, road works, etc) and targeted obvious black spots, then the cameras may not get such a bad rap.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Grunter

No, just ban the usual suspects, who feel the need to continually push their extreme views both ways, with zero acceptance for any view points other than their own.

Except for those few muppets, the vast majority of members can discuss these types of topics rationally with no problems, and without having to resort to belittling others views.

I will say that I believe speed cameras do slow down most motorists overall (edit. should have said "most motorists that may let their speed creep up a little. those that willfully speed, will continue to do so). I don't think a great number of cameras are in locations that have a recent history of speed related accidents (in my observation). I do completely believe that the current government in Qld use them as a revenue stream with no real aim at safety. It's a perception thing that if the speed camera revenue was directed to road
safety improvements (training, road works, etc) and targeted obvious black spots, then the cameras may not get such a bad rap.

Agreed 100%

[DJR-351]

Originally Posted by Grunter

No, just ban the usual suspects, who feel the need to continually push their extreme views both ways, with zero acceptance for any view points other than their own.

Except for those few muppets, the vast majority of members can discuss these types of topics rationally with no problems, and without having to resort to belittling others views.

I will say that I believe speed cameras do slow down most motorists overall (edit. should have said "most motorists that may let their speed creep up a little. those that willfully speed, will continue to do so). I don't think a great number of cameras are in locations that have a recent history of speed related accidents (in my observation). I do completely believe that the current government in Qld use them as a revenue stream with no real aim at safety. It's a perception thing that if the speed camera revenue was directed to road safety improvements (training, road works, etc) and targeted obvious black spots, then the cameras may not get such a bad rap.

I will go with that....

Most off the time when i get to one of these threads the usual suspects (on both sides of the fence) have sunk it into the usual slanging match, by then i can’t bothered putting my 2c worth in...

[delete94]

Originally Posted by kpcart

by the way the australian population, and especially the number of cars and drivers on the road is increasing, (as well as the population of arrogant drivers who like to drive at whatever speed they want). so ofcourse the road fatality statistics will increase.

To many people, getting a fine makes them think more when they drive and focus on not breaking rules, as they dont want another penalty.... BUT to the likes of people in this forum and especially "car enthusiats" it just brings out more hate against authority. whats wrong with people these days? you all hate authority, but when you are in serious trouble, whats the first number you call? 000 (until the next day, when you start complaining about how long they took to provide help to your obnoxious needs).

And as for you mate, I am a car enthusiast. And by virtue of that very fact, I have a very, very clear understanding of the consequences of what a vehicle can do, both to myself and to others, if not treated with respect.

You’re obviously not a car enthusiast, otherwise you wouldn’t be on here sprouting such idiotic drivel.

Oh, and as a “car enthusiast”, I, like I’m sure most others on here, actually have a healthy respect for the law. I actually don’t want to lose my license, because, as a “car enthusiast” I actually love to drive. Could drive for hours, 7 days a week and love every minute of it, unlike you I’m sure.

So don’t lump me into the same category as that minority who flout the law, cause most times they’re usually not “car enthusiasts”, but just idiots.

[burnz]

you can break every rule in the book but one, speed.
safety cams got you covered. "safely"

[burnz]

claimed 98% of all fatal acco's are below the posted speed limit.
http://rcandelori.wordpress.com/2011...l-on-speeding/

govco very quiet.
http://www.roadsense.com.au/misleading_data.html

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by burnz

claimed 98% of all fatal acco's are below the posted speed limit.
http://rcandelori.wordpress.com/2011...l-on-speeding/

govco very quiet.
http://www.roadsense.com.au/misleading_data.html

....a blog by a person who isnt worried about japanese reactors and another website claiming some sort of authority, but is just another "nutjob" having a whinge about getting fined.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by sudszy

....a blog by a person who isnt worried about japanese reactors and another website claiming some sort of authority, but is just another "nutjob" having a whinge about getting fined.

you fail!!

[falconnut]

At least you guys can be civil about it, on OCAU and WP these sort of discussions turn into a 100 page **** flinging contest and the mods overcompensate and ban people :p

Originally Posted by burnz

claimed 98% of all fatal acco's are below the posted speed limit.
http://rcandelori.wordpress.com/2011...l-on-speeding/

govco very quiet.
http://www.roadsense.com.au/misleading_data.html

Does not suprise me at all, i have always thought mobile speed camera's and their past roadside/permanant iterations where just to raise revinue, i am all for getting dumbshits off the road but speed camera's do nothing, remember how 100km/h and averages for truckies where meant to stop them speeding/driving like ****? Well yeah it did not work!

[falconnut]

Sudszy is the typical type of person that allows Big Brother to do the **** they do.

Call us 'nutjobs' but people who are always behind the curve like yourself could not see change if it hit you in the face and called you a liar.

All welcome our tripod overlords!

http://www.redflex.com/html/global/index.php

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by falconnut

Sudszy is the typical type of person that allows Big Brother to do the **** they do.

Call us 'nutjobs' but people who are always behind the curve like yourself could not see change if it hit you in the face and called you a liar.

Sorry Falconnut I wasnt referring to other users as "nutjobs".

i was referring to the people that start anticamera websites(coincidentally many push an anti agw agenda as well) as 'nutjobs', you have started such a site?.....or is it because you have "nut" in your username that you are sensitive about?

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Sorry Falconnut I wasnt referring to other users as "nutjobs".

i was referring to the people that start anticamera websites(coincidentally many push an anti agw agenda as well) as 'nutjobs', you have started such a site?.....or is it because you have "nut" in your username that you are sensitive about?

Seems the same people are here pushin the same agendas, wrong place. Maybe you would be better off on a traffic law forum.